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Thursday, May 21 2009 by


Just a test really to play with this facility. Spent half hour finding my way around and building watchlists etc and I'm well impressed so far.

I have a feeling many Fools may arrive in the next few days. Maybe you can use this thread to announce your presence and just to test out your first post and any other OT comments.

Obviously this area may in time become as active as the Fool O&G companies board. Perhaps we will need to request an O&G markets board? Maybe we don't need a separate E&P board?

And I like the power I have by starting this thread ;-)

In authoring a new thread, you become responsible for moderating and maintaining discipline and order to the discussions.

I like the Italics button!

And the bold one ;-)


And now I also like the "edit" button. I hope! Trying this out approx 3 hours after original post to see if there is any notification of the update given or change in time stamp against the OP.....


As per our Terms of Use, Stockopedia is a financial news & data site, discussion forum and content aggregator. Our site should be used for educational & informational purposes only. We do not provide investment advice, recommendations or views as to whether an investment or strategy is suited to the investment needs of a specific individual. You should make your own decisions and seek independent professional advice before doing so. The author may own shares in any companies discussed, all opinions are his/her own & are general/impersonal. Remember: Shares can go down as well as up. Past performance is not a guide to future performance & investors may not get back the amount invested.

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266 Posts on this Thread show/hide all

doverbeach 2nd Jun '09 147 of 266

how do I link to a specific post, rather than a whole thread?  Is this what the 'permlink' thing is for that doesn't seem to work?


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Murakami 2nd Jun '09 148 of 266

Hi, that's the idea of the permalink - if you copy that link, it will take the person to that post, highlighted with a black border (eventually, we will give the post its own page but this is a temporary solution which should be ok). Please email if you experience any problems with it.

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Murakami 2nd Jun '09 149 of 266

In reply to doverbeach (post #146)

Hi, that's the idea of the profile stock forum activity sentiment. It is based on a user's sentiment, rather than general sentiment. I think that in your case, it may not be working because all your sentiment is neutral, which is a case we didn't consider, and it still has the bull/bear labels at the top and bottom. We will amend that.

If you experience any issues, please let us know using the Bug feedback form on the left ("Help us improve this page") as it's easier for us to track that way. Thanks.

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doverbeach 2nd Jun '09 150 of 266

In reply to Murakami (post #148)

re permalink - I did get an error earlier today, I think when I wass trying to work how to link to marben's post on the Dana thread.  It was a variation on a sort of 404 error message with /permalink at the end I think - sorry I wasnt paying much attention because I wasn't sure what it was for .


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marben100 3rd Jun '09 151 of 266

Greeting Fellow Foolish Investors!

Has anyone set up a thread for general investment ideas/analysis? What I have in mind is something along the lines of PPP BUT that when a specific stock is discussed, rather than cluttering the general thread with that discussion, the post that highlights the issue/news/analysis redirects to an appropriate thread for that subject. For example, when an AGM writeup is done, a post could be made on the general thread directing the reader to the thread for the stock who's AGM has been written up; discussion relating to the AGM/stock can then continue on that thread, rather than the general one.




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Murakami 3rd Jun '09 152 of 266

Hi, sounds fine to us. We are setting up a General Forum Tab shortly (probably later today) for threads on Orientation (like this one) and Frequently Asked Questions (other suggestions welcome) so, if someone wants to name and create such a Thread somewhere, we will move it into the relevant area shortly.

Any suggestions for naming rights? We could call such a thread "General Investment Discussion" or "Latest Site Discussions" unless someone suggests something more creative...


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doverbeach 4th Jun '09 153 of 266

re emptyend's recent post on GBP saying that infuture he will probably moderate away TA posts on his threads...

Can I suggest that if people want to do this, they should put NO TA ON THIS THREAD PLEASE in bold in the thread header? Do people agree this would be a reasonable way of tackling the issue?


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MrT 4th Jun '09 154 of 266

In reply to doverbeach (post #153)

Good idea, agreed.

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doverbeach 5th Jun '09 155 of 266

When should new threads be started?

It seems to me that this is a big question - mostly for the users to decide, but there are spin off implications for site design. I guess most people here are familiar with advfn and TMF - both sites have their plus points but people here will be hoping that this site evolves into something that is better than both of those and usability goes to the heart of this.

At the moment we have a situation where people tend to carry on using existing threads, advfn style. It may be because there is little site traffic at the moment - almost anything is workable when it is trivial to read all new posts in a day - but I suggest that we need to collectively think about when to start a new thread before the site ethos gets established.

The advantage of carrying on with an existing thread is that prolonged discussion about a topic can be kept together.  So for Aminex there are threads running for N Korea and for Tanzania, which seems sensible.

But there are lots of problems here.

It works much less well when the original thread header was not well designed for this purpose. So for Serica, there is an existing thread header called something Like Serica and the other asian stocks - well all the posts on the thread are Serica related and there are none comparing serica to salamander or whoever. 

It is useless for breaking news - The Dragon takeover is being discussed under the heading of "yet another hammering" and the Heritage takeover under "Miran reserves and revenue". A new post on these threads would not have alerted someone that didnt follow those stocks to major news of interest to anyone in the sector.  It doesn't have to be quite as dramatic as this - anyone wanting to point out a 10 or 15% rise in a stock has their post effectively disguised.

Even where a thread header has been designed sensibly around an issue, it still can't handle new news very weel - say I started a new thread now on Tullow's Ngassa well, looking at it progress, importance etc.  The day the result comes out, if it is posted on this thread, the info will all be kept together (which is good) but the impact is lost on anyone not reading the Tullow thread, whereas a new "Ngassa Success - 15,000 bpd!" thread would attract attention.

And even where there is no new news, thread headers and especially their titles can age badly. the "Another hammering" for Dragon was arguably inappropriate well before the news yesterday of a takeover. Of course, headers - and their titles - can be updated by the thread owner. But in practice they often aren't.  Especially if they are started by someone who isn't an expert in the stock.

The end result is that important / interesting stuff is being posted with no title to the post to alert the community to what it contains.

My feeling is that we should be keener to start new threads where the old one doesn't seem quite right. This will downplay the importance of the headers - that I think is fine and I would rather people put the effort into the stock wiki - this will be encouraged when the current straightjacket format is removed.

We will still be able to find all the threads for a stock. And all the threads for a sector.

Do other people think this is a good way forward?

If people agree, then the following are some suggestions for ways to make the site more in tune with this approach, basically downplaying the size and importance of the headers:

  • redesign of the stock wiki is already planned
  • remove the exhortation to write 100 words at least - just "xxx suspended - rumours of bid" will do fine!
  • remove (or make it an option to show, with the default being OFF) the box in the header which has the contributor info  - it makes the headers much longer.  If someone has only written a few lines, it is  impossible to view the header and the nest few posts of the thread at the same time.
  • can the graph in the header be chaged to show the current day's price?  even if it lags 20 mins (and not lagging is a VERY big plus point for advfn)?  I don't think the historical graph warrants the space it takes up, so I think it to should be removed removed. The Chart tab is there for anyone who wants to see the graph (btw that too needs to have a Today option, show inra day prices for periods of less than 10 days and I think it should default to closing price).

I would also suggest that the column orders in the forum overviews are changed, so the ticker is on the left and the thread header name comes next - it often isnt obvious from the header name what the stock is, so you want to read the context first then the headline, not the other way round.  And when the site gets busier, it will help people a lot if the stock name is shown rather than the ticker - for example  I was familiar with Ceres as a company but had no idea what its ticker was.



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waiting4godot 5th Jun '09 156 of 266


I am so glad to have read what you have written above coz it saves me writing it!

I agree almost 100% with your analysis of the problem but have a different take on the solution.

I reckon leave the front page as is (misleading thread titles, warts and all). It has the advantage of showing what has been posted recently which you could only do on TMF by using the mark all as read button and in so doing perhaps miss posts you were saving to read later.

The consistent part of the thread header is, in the main, either a) the epic or b) the sector (irony here is I am discussing this in the Oil & gas Producers section). This part of the header could be used to produce company or sector specific sections (yeah! just like TMF!) where all relevant threads (with useful or not so useful titles) could go together.



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emptyend 5th Jun '09 157 of 266

In reply to nigelpm (post #140)

To the Devs - What's the score with moderating?

I've just had a post moderated from a thread for no reason whatsoever.  Who has the power and what are the terms?

If it's the post creator I think that is something that requires change - you will get posts being removed just because something is posted that the OP doesn't agree with rather than for genuine reasons.

Hi Nigel,

The answer to this is to ignore threads started by certain people, because those who post dross are also unlikely to moderate in a reasonable manner. I can guess which one was the problem ;-)

The ultimate santion is for Stockopedia to withdraw someone's right to start a thread (and therefore moderate)....or, indeed, ban them completely.

For the developers, I would find it helpful to be reminded in the "active threads" view of who the principal moderator of a thread actually is. And it might also be useful (longer term!!) to have somewhere in the system the percentage of posts that poster XYZ has moderated in each of the threads they have started, because those that have more posts deleted are less likely to be worth contributing to (for a range of reasons!)



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djpreston 5th Jun '09 158 of 266

In reply to doverbeach (post #155)

Hi db

Yes, another one entirely in agreement.

The wiki should be the natural home of all the data - say areas of operation etc etc and then threads dealing with breaking news should be more easy to spot. 

I do like the idea of having a more general sector board, a big like the O&G or mining boards on TMF where a breaking news type post could lead across to the company "home" for greater discussion, thereby ensuring the information relating to that company is in one place (albeit different threads. That way, anyone new to a company could go through that company's "home" and see the evolution of the story without having to try and find reference to that company on other boards.


Fund Management: European Wealth
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Murakami 5th Jun '09 159 of 266

In reply to doverbeach (post #155)

Great post - just the sort of detailed, constructive input that really helps us. It's worthy of more reflection and a more considered response, but just one thing in the meantime. We had actually been hoping that people would post news in the News area - e.g. http://www.stockopedia.com/news/user/Oil_and_Gas_Producers - whereas the Forums (and the Wiki) would be more about sharing stock analysis, opinion and sentiment. That doesn't seem to be happening at the moment.  Conceptually, it would be nice to separate them, but the Forums seem to be being used for everything. Maybe that's because the distinction is so blurred between the two. Any further thoughts on this?

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promethean 5th Jun '09 160 of 266

db... Thanks for the extremely constructive message.

FYI - we have unlocked the Executive Summaries of the wikis.  At present you can only edit by section... but we could change this easily.  Our motivation for doing this was to encourage a consistent approach across all stocks - but clearly one size doesn't fit all... Any more comments on the wiki would be extremely helpful.

We also were considering adding the option to wikify thread headers - and add other contributors - any further comments on that?  So you could either just post a normal message, or create a more extensive wikified thread - which would be more likely to be upkept.

Re. charts/top contributors - we entirely agree... we are going to make  them optional, and more modular - e.g. add a chart & 5 recent RNS headlines etc...

Intraday charts - we are working on it, but our hands are a little tied by our data provider !


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djpreston 5th Jun '09 161 of 266

In reply to Murakami (post #159)


I think that the reason for the lack of posts on the news thread is that people (like me) didnt actually realise that you could post in that section (even though, I now notice that it obviously says I can - D'oh).

I had initially thought that it was just a tab that gave you the news relating to a stock or sector and that people woudl then start a thread relating to the news if there was a desire.

One thing we must guard against is content and comment being spread over too wide an variety of areas. Id have thought that just having a "news" reported section with threads in the "home" forum of a sector or stock woudl be the way to go?



Fund Management: European Wealth
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promethean 5th Jun '09 162 of 266

DJP - v. good point made.

What I'd ideally like to see is people posting news items into threads as normally, but perhaps providing a checkbox with a submit link popup that allowed them to 'contextualise' the post as a 'news' item... then we could show that post in the news section as well as on the boards...

Is that too complicated or does anyone agree?

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bondrich 5th Jun '09 163 of 266


I have just come form Fool as I could'nt figure out the search function for the discussion boards.

I like the discussions on iii as the correct stocks are easy to find and they list the latest most recent first, which is the way I think it should be (or at least have that option)  

I have just started here 10 minutes ago and am writing this for the second time as the first time it did'nt post!?


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doverbeach 5th Jun '09 164 of 266

Like Darron, I hadnt realised users could post news. In fact I had been ignoring that section completely as your provider seems so slow :(

But it doesnt seem very useful to me - as Darron says it is splitting the content. Better surely to get people to start a new thread, so the news can be discussed. So I think the ability to post an item of news should be removed.  I think the iea of a check box for 'post also as News' is an interesting idea - provided that someone starting at the news item can then get to the relevant thread. I keep getting database arrors when I try to look at the News page, so I am not sure what is possible from there.

re the suggestion to wikify the headers. Personally I think it is better to get people to work on the stock wiki and accept that most threads should have limited lives. Sure ee could keep updating the Aminex Tanzania header - but surely it is better to have a Tanzania section in Aminex's wiki that is updated instead?

What we want to get to is where the users see the forums as the starting point for news and analysis, but also actively use the tabs to get to the stock wiki, the regulatory news, the stock's chart etc.  Thus promoting the sort of in depth information that you can't get from any other bulletin board.

charts/top contributors - we entirely agree... we are going to make  them optional, and more modular - e.g. add a chart & 5 recent RNS headlines etc...


Intraday charts - we are working on it, but our hands are a little tied by our data provider !

cough - are you sure you have got the right data provider?  Good prices and news flow are key.  I suspect this comes back to site economics, which you don't want to discuss...


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promethean 5th Jun '09 165 of 266

Very happy to discuss site economics if you wish - but parts of our business model must remain confidential until the features are released.  I'm sure you understand that we can't let our competitors know our plans at a time when we are effectively a minnow.

The fundamental goal right now is to create the site that the people using it actually want.... rather than something they endure.

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rpcroft 5th Jun '09 166 of 266

Regarding the wikification of headers. I think this is an excellent idea, and feel that it may be the key to getting wiki content. Incorporation of the wikified header into the wiki proper would be great. Regarding editorial control of wikified headers, would the plan be to allow the thread initiator to have control and be able to invite informed posters to become co-moderators/ contibutors? This might work well. Keeping the spoiling element low would be key and trusted thread members could have full access and all contributors  welcome but contributions pre vetted by the designated moderators? One could perhaps even have a "add it to the wiki" voting box for thread entries.

Multiple wiki pages per stock would be fine, especially if there were a central view page giving some sort of summary of each and showing thread activity from each...perhaps votes on wiki pages too.

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