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Archived articleThis is an archived article from 2021 - please note that any content within the article may be out of date.

Small Cap Value Report (Thu 11 Mar 2021) - PHTM, PCIP, RWI

Good morning, it’s Paul here with the SCVR for Thursday.

Timing - it's slow going again today, but I'll keep plodding on until mid to late afternoon.

Agenda - firstly a couple of catch up items which I prepared last night -

Photo-me International (LON:PHTM) - Preliminary results FY 10/2020 - done

Pci- Pal (LON:PCIP) (I hold) - my notes from today's interim results webinar - done

Renewi (LON:RWI) - Trading update for FY 03/2021. Significantly ahead of expectations. Terrible balance sheet, but does it matter?

Restaurant (LON:RTN) - placing & results - to do, sorry this is late

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Online results webinars

There are 2 interesting small software companies doing InvestorMeetCompany webinars today -

10:00 - Pci- Pal (LON:PCIP) (I hold) - see my review of interim results here on 8 March - see my notes on the webinar below

14:00 - Beeks Financial Cloud (LON:BKS) - see my review of interim results & contract extensions here, yesterday

I’d like to echo a reader comment from a few days ago, that many of us are finding these results webinars incredibly useful. Many thanks to all the companies who go the extra mile to provide such quality information and access, to their smaller shareholders, we really appreciate it!

All companies, large and small, should do an online results presentation, so that the playing field is levelled up between institutions and private investors (PIs).

Companies I talk to are really pleased to be getting more engaged with their PIs, enjoying the process, and seeing clear benefits from it - improved liquidity, and higher share prices, once they get their investment proposition out to PIs.

This is not just a reaction to lockdown, we need these online results webinars to continue permanently, as it’s a far more practical way to engage with PIs who may have day jobs & not be able to get into London for meetings.

Management traits - It’s great to get a feel for the people who are actually running the company, hence why I enjoy results webinars so much. I also like it when they involve other team members in the presentations, not just the CEO and CFO.

Personally, with small caps, I’m looking for hands-on entrepreneurs (preferably founders, and with large personal shareholdings ideally). I’m also looking for signs of honesty, passion & energy - but those can be easily faked, so it's tricky!

I couldn’t give two hoots about any other aspects of management backgrounds, because good entrepreneurs come in all shapes & sizes, and from any background. That said, a track record of previous successes is a good sign. If they actually were successful - it's always good to independently verify that.

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Photo-me International (LON:PHTM)

51p (down 7% yesterday) - mkt cap £193m

Preliminary Results

Photo-Me International plc (PHTM.L), the instant-service equipment group, announces its results for the 18 months and 12 months ended 31 October 2020.

This is unusual, in that two sets of figures, for 12 and 18 months are presented, because the year end has been extended from 30 April, to 31 October. Year end changes are a real nuisance, as they mess up year-on-year comparatives, but there can sometimes be sensible reasons to do so.

There can also be negative reasons - am sure I’ve told you before that back in 1996 I changed the year end of my employer, in order to extend it to 16 months, so that it would include two peak Christmas trading periods, and thereby produce a profit. It worked, nobody seemed to notice, and it saved the business from almost certain bankruptcy if I had published the loss-making 12-month figures. This saved over 1,000 jobs, was completely legal and fully disclosed, so I have no regrets over doing it.

In the case of PHTM, I think the most meaningful comparison is the 12 month comparison from FY 10/2020 and FY 10/2019 provided. The figures look grim, as I would expect since it includes covid lockdown 1 -

  • Revenues down 21% to £186.3m
  • Adjusted profit before tax is a £(26.0)m loss, versus a £45.9m profit - but there is a £34m hit for impairments & provisions in the 2020 figures, so it’s a £6m profit before those costs
  • Net cash little changed at £21.9m, vs £25.2m a year earlier
  • Covid impact “severe”

There’s a serious threat (my words) to PHTM’s photo booths in the UK, since home-taken photos are now accepted for official documents such as passports - are they still needed, and will they recover? I have serious doubts over this. Although PHTM does operate in 17 countries, not just the UK. UK revenues are only 16% of group total. Continental Europe is the biggest market, at 63% of the total.

Restructuring has been undertaken to remove unprofitable photo booths

Laundry machines growing, but only represents 7.7% of total vending estate

PHTM doesn’t split out profits of its various activities, making it impossible to gauge the future potential of the business. Until it properly discloses where the profits & losses are generated, then it’s uninvestable to me, as I’ve said before.

Depreciation (and amortisation) charges are particularly large, at £29.2m for 12m to Oct 2020. So even if loss-making, this business could remain cash generative.

Dividends - was the main reason to hold this share. But these have stopped now, and can’t be paid until a loan backed by the French Govt is repaid.

Guidance - well done to the company for providing guidance for the current year, FY 10/2021 -

The visibility on the market outlook for 2021 remains extremely limited. Nevertheless, subject to the factors above, the Board looks forward to achieving revenue of £175 million in FY21 (12 months to 31 October 2021), and profit before tax will be £9.0 million before any exceptional items, and also expects that the Group will be cash flow positive.

Financial resources - the company says these are sufficient.

Whilst the Board continues to believe that there are some longer-term opportunities in the photo ID market and continues to install photobooths in countries outside of the UK, it anticipates that short-term demand for photo ID will be subdued and may not recover fully to pre-COVID-19 levels.

Laundry machines only generated 19% of group revenues, and we don’t seem to be told how profitable they are. There’s heavy capex of £14.4m on this division. Is it generating a good return?

My opinion - unfortunately, this share is impossible to value, on the basis of the information provided. The problem is that the segmental analysis only gives performance by geographic regions. What we actually need, is a divisional breakdown of what profit/losses are made by each activity, i.e. photobooths, laundry machines, juicing machines, shown separately. Plus we need full information on the return generated from each new machine (payback period, etc), in the expanding products, and an analysis of how the declining photo booth business might be scaled down, and how long it's likely to take to disappear - is it 5-10 years, or longer? Who knows?

The photobooth business reminds me a bit of newspapers - it’s structurally declining, and is likely to die out completely in the future, but nobody knows how long that decline is going to take. As we’ve seen with Reach (LON:RCH) it has managed to constantly strip out costs, buy up competitors, and diversify into new areas (digital), so it’s lasted a lot longer already than most people seemed to think. And Reach is still highly profitable & cash generative.

Maybe PHTM could be similar? Downsizing the estate, and stripping out costs, whilst building up new areas of business such as laundry & others, could be a viable strategy for many years, I have no idea.

I’ve got no figures on any of those business units, so it’s not possible to do any meaningful analysis, nor value the shares I’m afraid.

The 5-year chart below reflects the structurally declining main business of photobooths. It’s an unusual chart, in that there’s been little bounce from the lows a year ago. Maybe there could be upside once travel gets back to normal, as that might drive some upsurge in the use of photo kiosks? Or at least we could see a bounce, purely on a recovery in investor sentiment? So there might be a short term trade here, for a possible rebound? Lots of declining businesses are seeing big rebounds at the moment, so this could be worth thinking about.

I don’t think there’s likely to be any solvency risk, as the business has plenty of liquidity, with a large cash pile, and should still be nicely cash generative once re-opening happens in Europe.

Overall, it’s impossible to value, so let’s move on.

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Pci- Pal (LON:PCIP)

(I hold)

97p - mkt cap £56m

Here are my notes from the interim results webinar this morning. This is in addition to my own review of the results here on Monday this week.

I jotted down the points which seemed most important to me, and my comments, so this is not necessarily comprehensive of everything that was said.

You should be able to watch the recording of this webinar when published in the next few days, on InvestorMeetCompany, it’s worthwhile watching, as a lot of useful info was imparted.

  • Long intro by the CEO, useful background - seems a straightforward, hands on manager, so I’m happy with the people (same with CFO)
  • Review of costs - I had a concern here that costs seem to be rising too fast, thus preventing operational gearing from reducing the losses enough. Explanations given made sense, as follows;
  • Amazon hosting up by £100k to £375k. This is reported under “other expenses” but seems to me that it would make more sense to put it in cost of sales.
  • Forex hit of £366k in other expenses, which contradicts what the CFO said about having natural hedging. Maybe some actual hedging is needed (currently not done)? Or should we just accept that it’s swings & roundabouts, and hedging would be an additional cost?
  • Staff costs only up 11% to £2.95m - NB all these numbers are for H1, so 6 month figures
  • Balance sheet - receivables - some US clients not paying on time, have unilaterally decided to pay on 90 days, company is discussing this with them
  • Bank borrowings of £2.1m being repaid at £100k per month
  • Cash used in H1 was down, at £(937)k, from £1.5m per half year in previous 2 halves
  • Most recent, end Feb 2021, gross cash of £4.6m, net cash £2.6m - looks adequate, but I would prefer a stronger cash position, so a small placing might make sense. Although I don't want to be diluted, so maybe not.
  • There will be a cash outflow over the quieter summer months, but co has adequate headroom
  • Channel partners are now main selling route - going well & building - large scale opportunity
  • Me - impressive clients & channel partners in the US, some big names (reminds me a bit of Intercede (LON:IGP) - I also hold)
  • Key point - old contracts were done on a revenue share basis, so had 55% gross margin. New cloud contracts (bulk of the business & all new signings) are on AWS and are much higher gross margin, because PCIP owns the platform, it’s not shared with anyone else. Just pays AWS £375k pa hosting fees.
  • US market is a serious scale opportunity - currently small, but growing very fast (over 100% p.a.), expected to overtake UK as main market. Only started in US in 2018
  • Europe - signed major pan-European airline, recently gone live.
  • Breakeven - June 2021 should be at a breakeven monthly run rate. Leading to profitability in FY 06/2022 - very important point
  • Slide 17 - key metric is time to go live - reduced by 16% to 3.7 months, easier now product is cloud-based & no need to visit clients, can all be done remotely
  • Q&A - Growth? Mgt is ambitious, and need to deliver shareholder value. TACV (annualised contract value) is the key metric
  • Customer churn? Very low. Partly helped by being quite a new business in cloud, but older clients on conventional systems prove very sticky too
  • Covid impact? Deferred some new contracts, but had caught up by June 2020.
  • Average contract value? About £20k p.a. recurring revenues. Most deals are small, which is what they want - targeting the large number of smaller contact centres (c.250 seats). Can do big contracts too, e.g. 5k seats deal last year.
  • Average contract length? 2 to 2.5 years initial contract term, but nearly all contracts automatically renew every 12 months, so contract length isn’t an issue. Customers very sticky once PCIP is embedded in their systems

My opinion - this was a very useful session, and helped deepen my understanding of the business. Obviously the share price has gone bananas recently, which I think is justified. At some stage shorter term punters will probably want to bank their profits, so it probably needs to take a breather for a while, and let the company grow into the valuation.

Personally, I’ve put this share into my “coffee can” portfolio (see 100 Baggers by Christopher Mayer - who suggests treating the best growth companies in your portfolio as permanent holds, in a “coffee can” under your bed). The other reason for riding out price volatility, is that it’s so difficult to buy this share, it’s very tightly held, and I’ve heard a market rumour that there are institutions itching to get in, but who can’t find any stock. I had a lot of difficulty building up my own position, and am not letting go of them. In my view PCIP has a very good market opportunity, and if demand remains strong, then the numbers could be very good in say 5+ years’ time.

As I mentioned at Mello Monday this week, when we discussed PCIP, we have to be a bit careful in thinking we're all geniuses at the moment, because a lot of smaller, speculative-ish companies are shooting up in price. I gave the example of Eagle Eye Solutions (LON:EYE) as another loss-making but nearing profitability SaaS company, whose shares have also shot up. I'm sure there are plenty of others too, so many share graphs look similar at the moment. So to measure this, I've plotted below the two year chart for PCIP and EYE. It's quite remarkable - they're moving almost in lockstep, despite being unconnected companies. That nicely demonstrates that we're seeing widespread sector moves. The danger of that is if these companies disappoint in the future, then there's a greater height to fall from. So risk does rise, with the share price, exhilarating though it is during the big upward phases. Hence I do understand why some investors top slice some profits after a big move up.

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Renewi (LON:RWI)

50.5p (up 10% at 12:42) - mkt cap £405m

Preamble - riisky shares - I’ve only looked at Renewi once, here on 1 Oct 2020, where there were aspects I liked about the company, but also some problems, especially a terrible balance sheet with NTAV negative at Euros(375)m. That ruled it out for me. Pity, because the shares have more than doubled since then. Risk-taking is certainly paying off well, at the moment, but it lulls investors into bad habits I think, that could prove very costly in future. Maybe we should relax our tolerance for risk in a bull market, but switch it back on again when conditions worsen?

On the other hand, with ultra low interest rates, and Govt support schemes in place to stop companies going bust, maybe we should be taking more risk, since the taxpayer is backstopping our risk in many cases? I can see some merit in that argument. It’s important to be flexible on strategy, especially if you keep missing out on big risers. On balance though, I’m prepared to miss out on riskier stuff, because my safer things are doing pretty well too, and I can sleep at night holding them! Sorry, I’m rambling off the point, getting back to Renewi...

Trading update

Renewi plc (LSE: RWI), the leading international waste-to-product business, announces its pre-close trading update for the year ending 31 March 2021.

Continued to trade well in Q4, driven by core business

Overall - this looks good -

Given the strong Commercial performance, Group underlying EBIT for FY21 is now expected to be significantly ahead of our previous expectations at around €68m.

EBIT is another word for operating profit. I don’t trust that since IFRS 16 messed things up - because operating costs relating to property rental costs can end up in finance costs, which is lower down the P&L than EBIT. Thus EBIT can be inflated, and just wrong basically, particularly at companies with lots of rented premises.

That said, significantly ahead of expectations is positive, at whatever profit measure it’s reported at.

Cash/debt - also better than expected, helped by creditor stretch (not quantified unfortunately) -

The Group's cash performance is also expected to end the year materially better than previous expectations. Core net debt excluding IFRS 16 lease liabilities will likely be less than €350m (FY20: €457m) and the leverage ratio below 2.5x driven by strong trading performance and Covid-19 cash actions including taxation deferrals.

Outlook - sounds a bit hesitant, but not alarming -

Notwithstanding the Group's strong performance in FY21, the Board remains suitably cautious at this stage regarding the outlook for the financial year ending 31 March 2022 given the uncertainty as to the varied impacts of lockdown restrictions ending, recyclate prices, and a potential late cycle slowdown in the construction sector.

It’s important to remember that Europe is lagging behind the UK in covid terms, so re-opening there could be delayed. That said, does it matter for Renewi, since it seems to have coped well with covid so far. Recycling has to carry on regardless, so it seems a resilient activity.

Longer term, the transition to increased recycling will continue to support our business model. The sustainability agenda and the potential for a "green recovery" supported by the EU and national governments are expected to present attractive opportunities for Renewi to convert waste into a wider range of high-quality secondary materials.

We remain confident our three strategic growth initiatives - recovery of earnings at ATM, the Renewi 2.0 programme and our innovation pipeline - will deliver significant additional earnings over the next three years and beyond.

My opinion - this is a good update I think, and I like the outlook comments. As when reporting last time, I can see the attraction of this share. It’s just the debt which worries me. Should we treat this as a special case, in that it can raise cheap & plentiful debt from green bonds? Quite possibly.

Overall, if you can tolerate a risky balance sheet, then this share could be worth a closer look.

I’m not confident in my ability to analyse this sector, and don’t generally touch anything in regulated industries. That said, I’ve been sniffing around Augean (LON:AUG) (I hold) for a while, and dipped my toe in there, buying a starter size opening position a little while ago. On balance, I feel AUG is much more financial stable than Renewi, and seems to have a simpler, more focused business model. There is the outstanding question mark over its tax dispute, which is material, but fully funded.

Renewi is much bigger than Augean, and it does look potentially interesting. Although as the graphs below show, Renewi had quite a chequered performance before covid. Have the problems all been fixed? That would need proper research.

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81 comments


Avatar for abtan

Many thanks for all the responses on Oakley Capital Investments (LON:OCI) today. They are most appreciated and have certainly given me plenty of food for thought.

I have thumbs up'd each and every one in appreciation of your contributions.

Cheers

A

5
Avatar for Albertos

Begbies Traynor (LON:BEG)

Placing at a slight premium to fund acquisition - primary bid platform being used for Pi's.

Phil

5
Avatar for The Boon Fund

Tried to get an allocation at 6:30pm on PrimaryBid, but kept kicking me back out to the homepage, so assume they've closed the bookbuild earlier than the 8pm deadline because of strong demand for Begbies Traynor (LON:BEG)

Can't blame people jumping in. Placed at the current share price, and crunching through the numbers, looks like it should be at least 20% EPS enhancing for FY22, even after accounting for dilution.

5
Avatar for gus 1065

re. Begbies Traynor (LON:BEG) on Primary Bid, make sure you go in via the App rather than  via the Website.  They’ve moved most of their recent offers exclusively onto that platform. I tried to subscribe just now (18:48 ) and it still appeared to show the offer as open.  I haven’t followed through as I’m  not looking to participate in this one.

Gus.

2
Avatar for Simon Rowan

Ah thanks Dah. Just registered but no luck.

1
Avatar for Roger Baron

Anyone else noticed the stake building in Hammerson (LON:HMSO) by Morgan Stanley? 9 notifications in 3 weeks (2 today) and now over 10% holding.

0
Avatar for Carey Blunt

late news on the, selling a stake in some joint ventures.... https://bit.ly/38sgLxS

1
Avatar for barnetpeter

Quiet day today so pleased to see a very small but popular stock on here React (LON:REAT) has hit a new high. Cleaning company; will never perhaps be a high flyer but good to see a solid hard working type of company doing well.

It makes me wonder when / whether we will ever get back to normal? I travelled to Brighton yesterday (about 15 miles along the coast) for a routine BUPA health assessment (paid for as a non insured). The train I got at about 10am was completely empty apart from me. About 30 mins from one end of the line to the other. I saw no one get on or off at any stage. Just me paying a fiver. How much did that trip cost the operator?

I don't like health centres or hospitals at the best of times and am very lucky to have never had to have stayed in one since a baby over 63 years ago. Yet i felt a strange sense of relief being able to talk face to face to a doctor for an hour about my modest aches and pains while he checked my ears and tongue and heart and color of my skin (for visible changes and heat etc) and looked for any possible signs of cancer and so on....and castigated me for not doing enough exercise in lockdown. Cannot do all this on zoom he pointedly said.

I was lucky to get a late cancelled appointment. I heard the receptionist making appointments for months to come. "People just want to be seen by a doctor in person without any rush and they and companies who employ them do not mind paying for it" he told me. With the NHS having a huge backlog of non Covid cases likely to take years to clear, private health provision is going to be very busy indeed for many years I think.

23
Avatar for The Boon Fund

Hence why Spire Healthcare (LON:SPI) has had a massive share price recovery! 

0
Avatar for Star8

Just to add some texture to Paul's comments re Photo-Me (we have several long-standing holdings, all losing money): 

Serge Crasnianski the long standing  and prime mover  CEO bought an additional 7.7m shares in Photo-me,  declared on 30 October  2020 i.e. deep in the Covid pandemic. 

His total holding is now 105.1 million  shares or 27.8% of the company - serious money for anyone, even at today's reduced share price. He is obviously the person best placed to assess the company's future and he increased his holding.

The comments about the photo booths should also  be considered  in that their main decline is in the UK which, while a large market,  is not their main market. The last annual report states re the photo booths:

"In the UK, the trading environment remained challenging. The government’s policy to accept  photos taken at home for official documents and passport identification resulted in lower consumer demand and significantly eroded part of Photo-Me’s market share for ID photos.
Notably, European regulation does not permit this method.   "

So the European side, which is apparently  much larger by the number of machines, should not face the same decline.

The latest statement mentions removing 1500 photo units, 1367 of them in the UK, so the company seems well aware of its problems and  importantly, is taking decisive action.

Its' diversification into laundry machines seems successful and is growing, and, into fresh fruit juice, much less so. The fruit juice machine trial in Paris, now terminated,  seems to indicate a very limited opportunity for this venture.

The company seems to have an edge as the premier international vending machine operator. The problem is then: what growth products or services can it offer internationally?  It seems historically, able to generate cash with a good return on capital, assets and equity. It has its current problems but I do not take as dark a view as Paul. Certainly it is difficult to  value  and IMHO  it is not a buy for  at least some time. Perhaps one to watch  ?  

16
Avatar for Paul Scott

Hi Star8,

Great comments on Photo-me International (LON:PHTM) thanks.

I think you've slightly misunderstood what I've said. My main problem with the share is that the company doesn't provide enough information, so we cannot calculate how each division is performing. It could keep generating lots of cash for years to come.

The investment case seems to hinge on hoping that European & other Governments will require the use of passport photo booths forever, which seems quite risky.

What PHTM needs to do, is be more open about the various moving parts in its business. What are the economics of the laundry business? It could start by giving us a table, showing key metrics (not just revenue) of each segment, and the (say) 5 year history of profitability of each segment. Likely growth/decline rates, etc.

If we had that information, then we could have a stab at a spreadsheet model, which would enable us to value the share at least vaguely accurately. And run some scenarios (good, average, bad), to some up with a range of outcomes. Without that more granular information, I can only conclude that the share is impossible to value. It might turn out to be a good investment, I've no idea, because the information we need isn't made available.

So I'm not saying it's a bad company, just one that's currently not possible to value rationally without a lot more information.

Regards, Paul.

23
Avatar for Star8

Hi Paul

Thanks  for your comments and of course for your honest comments  and rare expertise.

What you say is of course correct- I also found it annoying that  the profitability per line of business was not given (ever or at least in the last few years). Having said that, if I owned nearly 30% of a company and had built it up over almost 50 years would I care what some relatively small shareholder thought and demanded ?

It is what it is and demanding as you rightly do, clearer and  better presented information is possibly a chimera.

5
Avatar for The Boon Fund

Why do you then want to hold shares where the dominant 27% shareholder and chairman (?) doesn't care about small shareholders? 

0
Avatar for greensiax

Here are my SCVR heat maps for today (prices as at ~10:30am).

Small / Micro Caps reporting today:

0597321a735474a186dd13b56ce976697a31bb0d1615461680.png


Big movers today in the SCVR world (moving more than a 20d EMA of the ATR against either yesterdays close, or today's open):

70572514b0abace418785ce6a99119e02cc8f46d1615461690.png


Warm regards, stay safe, and best of luck!

greensiax

PS: See my main heat map thread for more (non-SCVR specific) heat maps, and keys to the heat maps contents.

15
Avatar for Mark Penney

Hi Greensiax,

I look at your heatmaps everyday adn I am struggling to see how somebody can you use these sensibly  as many of the companies quoted have spreads of circa 3-8% bid-offers?  Moreover, are you saying that if a stock falls below its 20day moving average you shpould sell? Happy to be educated and please don't think this is criticism, merely wishing to understand how it should be used and what type of instrument: CFD/equities.

Thanks

Mark

 

17
Avatar for greensiax

Hi Mark,

I share these heatmaps to give a visual indication of what is going on in the SCVR world: who’s reporting and what’s moving a lot. Nothing else.

I am certainly not implying that you should buy or sell anything - only you can decide that :-)

If you read my heatmap thread I explain how I use heatmaps to help me with my research. 

Take care,

greensiax

9
Avatar for Surrey Steve

Cracking set of Q3 figures from Ig Group (LON:IGG) this morning with an interesting read across to Cmc Markets (LON:CMCX) - I hold both.  I know that neither technically qualify as Small Companies but I know that many readers either hold or use these trading platforms.  Undoubtedly there has been a boost from the GameStop publicity but both seem to be taking advantage of the fair wind affecting the sector.  Although it is difficult to assess how permanent the new higher levels of activity and revenue will be, they are persisting for now and indeed increasing further.  Both companies look undervalued to me.

19
Avatar for Dragon

Ig Group (LON:IGG) Did point this out in the outlook statement

"Should IG see normalisation in financial market volatility, or a stabilisation in the macro environment, we would anticipate some reduction in the level of client acquisition and activity, although underpinned by the larger high-quality client base."

1
Avatar for Rusty2

But have not IG Group (LON:IGG) just banned most of those CFD/SB transactions?

1
Avatar for JESSE LIVERMORE

No Herbie, Ig Group (LON:IGG) have reduced their leveraged instrument list from 17,000 to 16,000.

1
Avatar for Rusty2

Yes but many of those were giving them the volumes, such as Gamestop and AMC.

A few members on here have left because of IG Group (LON:IGG) handling of this. 

3
Avatar for Harry Hindsight

Why should they be your credit card for gambling. 

2
Avatar for Rusty2

I don’t gamble.

0
Avatar for Silver Moon

Ig Group (LON:IGG) is getting close to the 950 pence valuation at Aug/Sept 2016 when I forgot my promise and didn't sell. I still hold but meantime have missed many opportunities.

1
Avatar for Zipmanpeter

"The agreement with M&S adds to existing online partnerships that Sosandar has, having launched with both John Lewis and Next in August 2020. Sales to date from these partnerships have been strong, with a record month in February, with ranges in both continuing to expand."

Great work by Sosandar (LON:SOS) to get their range these 3 mid market, middle aged giants - exactly the right target audience/platform in my view for the brand as they now reach for breakthrough scale.  Very virtuous marketing progression likely from awareness to trial to purchase and re-purchase (inc from their own D2C website, with better margins).

Doing all the right things for LT success IMHO (I hold)

9
Avatar for WDWombat

I am just wading through the RNS releases and I must say that so far for me - along with a lesser one from HEIQ which I hold - this one really stands out. I have been pretty cynical on Sosandar's chances of survival in a super-competitive world and seriously unimpressed by the results to date.  But the announcement of a further revenue channel from a third major retailer bodes well. I will have another look but any more informed comments would be very welcome.

4
Avatar for fwyburd

Good morning Paul,

On the subject of online presentations, I applied to Buchanan PR to take part in Tuesday's analyst call for Rps (LON:RPS) (results 9th March if you feel so minded to have a look at them) but never received a reply. I'm not at all happy that small shareholders get excluded like this.

Rant over

Cheers

Francis

12
Avatar for garbetklb

Francis 

Totally agree re investor exclusion.  I really don't like companies employing communication / PR companies to filter shareholder interest.

In the case of Rps (LON:RPS) maybe worth an email to the chairman?

Andy

3
Avatar for fwyburd

Thanks Andy.

Having moaned here and on Twitter I got an email from the PR company saying they didn't get my email. I know of other PI's who failed to hear back from them so all I can assume is that they are useless/incompetent/don't care. Do you have his email address (I have looked but can't find it) as I think this is unacceptable?

cheers

Francis

1
Avatar for abtan

Oakley Capital Investments (LON:OCI) (no position)

https://www.londonstockexchang...

Results this morning indicated:

  • a NAV of 403p/£728m (of which £223m/31% is cash)
  • vs a Market Cap of 293p/£526m.

That's a discount of 28%, which seems too high for what appears to be a successful operator.

Either the share price is grossly undervalued, or I don't know how these things work...probably both.

For reference here is what they had to say about their discounted NAV:

"The share price volatility, driven by widespread uncertainty as to the economic impact of the pandemic, resulted in OCI's share price discount to NAV per share widening considerably in the period.

Some of this ground has been recovered, with a total shareholder return of 9% during the year, but a material discount persists.

We expect that sustained strong performance across the portfolio, alongside the continued work of the Board and its advisers, as outlined above, will result in closing the discount over time."

--------------------

Any opinions on why there is such a heavy discount to NAV would be most appreciated.

Cheers

A

13
Avatar for ken mitchell

abtan.

I hold Oakley Capital Investments (LON:OCI) and it’s just that some Private Equity Trusts are very popular with investors and others aren’t. The popular ones like HgCapital Trust (LON:HGT) (15% premium) and3i (LON:III) (23% premium) trade at premiums and successful Trusts in the sector at big discounts. The Oakley Capital Investments (LON:OCI) discount seems extreme. Oakley Capital Investments (LON:OCI) shares are up 27% over 1 year and 124% over 5. Buying back their shares has added 13p to the 403p NAV, but with share at 295p that’s some discount and imo Oakley Capital Investments (LON:OCI) is at a bargain price.

I also hold £HPVE Harbourvest also at a (smaller) 15% discount and up 24% over 1 year and 120% over 5.

8
Avatar for Luthrin

Re Oakley Capital Investments (LON:OCI)

"Any opinions on why there is such a heavy discount to NAV would be most appreciated."

Steven Tredget, a Partner at Oakley Capital, addressed this issue during the Q&A session of a Yellowstone Advisory webinar last month (at 44:44):

The company will be presenting on the Investor Meets Company platform on 16th March (12.00pm), and no doubt the same question will be asked once again.

David Stevenson (The Adventurous Investor) recently added Oakley to his Dynamic 35 list of growth-oriented investment trusts, and you can read his rationale for doing so here.

(Disclosure: I currently hold OCI)

8
Avatar for Phillip Arghebant

Dear Abtan

I am a shareholder in Oakley, having first purchased a holding in 2009 when its shares stood at an even larger discount to that prevailing today. Having met management not long afterwards, I realised that this then AIM-listed business was not really interested in private clients and this was later confirmed when the company raised a sizeable sum from several institutions at a large discount to the net asset value at that time. Private investors were not permitted to participate in the placing and consequently suffered considerable dilution alongside a large fall in the NAV. 

In recent years, mainly I suspect because of the large prevailing discount, the company has appointed an investor relations team who have done much to reverse the lack of historic communication and talk more engagingly about the various companies owned by Oakley. At the same time, the directors (mainly Peter Dubens) have purchased several millions of pounds worth of shares as a sign of their confidence in the business. 

Oakley Capital Investments is unusual in that it acts as a feeder for four Oakley Capital funds where it will own a percentage of some of those businesses. Perhaps some institutional investors are put off by this structure and, alongside the points I have made above,  may explain why there has been and continues to be a large discount to the net asset value. 

Next Wednesday there is a presentation by the company which is, I believe, open both to existing as well as potential private investors and it may be an opportunity to learn more about the underlying businesses within its portfolio.

I hope this is of some help.

Kind regards 

Phillip 

11
Avatar for AnonymousUser1004998

Oakley Capital Investments (LON:OCI) 's ongoing charge fee of 2.7%  p.a. plus performance fee makes it pretty unattractive next to ITs like Scottish Mortgage Investment Trust (LON:SMT) with 0.3% p.a. Also investors may be wary of the book valuations of unlisted digital businesses. According to HL the average discount to NAV is 34% so actually has narrowed a bit. I wouldn't invest with any manager that takes c. 3% p.a. even when losing money.

11
Avatar for Bouden54

Not sure if this is comparing apples with apples. Must be a lot more labour intensive to manage a direct investment private equity portfolio, where they work closely with the companies in a very hands on way. Scottish Mortgage is predominantly public equities, although admittedly there is a fair chunk in private early stage businesses. 

3
Avatar for ken mitchell

I think that 2.7% ongoing charge fee for Oakley Capital Investments (LON:OCI) includes the performance fee, but agree the too high charges are a negative. But charges across the Private Equity Investment Trust sector tend to be too high with some far higher than Oakley Capital Investments (LON:OCI). That’s not to defend them but to put the OCI charge in perspective.

e.g LMS charge is a whopping 5.69% and performance is very poor at just +7% for 1 year and minus 41% for 5 years.

High charges obviously eat in to performance but OCI performance is good despite the charges. Princes Private Equity charge is 4.24% but again performance is good. 1 year 21% and 5 114%.

If put off by too high Oakley Capital Investments (LON:OCI) charges, then an exception well worth checking out is Standard Life Private Equity Trust (LON:SLPE) with 1.15% charges including performance fee. That’s the lowest in the sector and performance is good. 1 year +32% and 5 year +158%. Their charges show no excuse for too many in the sector charging too much.

3
Avatar for Bouden54

SLPE is a fund of funds and I believe the ongoing charges figure you mention only relates to the charges and costs from Standard Life. The funds they invest in will also impose hefty charges which would probably bring it close to OCI. 

1
Avatar for AnonymousUser1004998

the other thing to watch out for with private equity is whether the investee companies have raised funding from other investors and and what valuation. Otherwise the NAV is just the opinion of the fund manager and his cronies. Woodford was rather guilty of this.  

2
Avatar for Laughton

Yes, good to see that some companies are making an effort to engage with investors. Yesterday Hipgnosis Songs Fund (LON:SONG) announced:

Invitation to Hipgnosis Songs Online Workshop

The Board of Hipgnosis Songs Fund Limited, the first UK listed investment company offering investors a pure-play exposure to songs and associated intellectual property rights, and its Investment Adviser, The Family (Music) Limited, are delighted to invite investors to attend an online workshop which will provide an introduction of Alternative Performance Measures as well as an insight into the Company's Song Management and revenue maximisation strategy. The workshop will be hosted by Merck Mercuriadis, Founder of Hipgnosis Songs Fund Limited and The Family (Music) Limited, and he will be joined by Chris Helm, Chief Financial Officer, Björn Lindvall, Chief Operating Officer, Ted Cockle, President, and Amy Thomson, Chief Catalogue Officer.

The event will take place on 16 March 2021 from 16:00 to 17:00 GMT.

Registration for the workshop is available at:

https://www.lsegissuerservices.com/spark/HipgnosisSongsFundLtd/events/502213b9-960c-4b3c-9d6c-d050ae8401e5

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Avatar for JohnEustace

I'm probably being unduly sceptical but being invited to a presentation by Hipgnosis Songs Fund (LON:SONG) on "Alternative Performance Measures" immediately puts my back up. The management company seems to collect their fee in the form of old fashioned money.

7
Avatar for Zipmanpeter

Absolutely agree re Photo-me International (LON:PHTM) - I think I want to buy into the Laundry business despite CAPEX as I think it will very boringly but dominantly and profitably meet a LT niche need.  The network of field engineer is a real moat (which in turn will help eke out profit from rides, booths and maybe juice machines for many years).   But until the investor investor info move away from, or is provided in addition to, the geographic analysis, I will never do so.  What is the point of presentations that don't explain - except to conceal

However, I think the dominanant CEO (>25% shareholder, there for donkey's years, elderly) will never change.  

I have been burnt and learnt from Stephen Marks at French Connection (LON:FCCN) who has remained irrational/unhelpful for far longer than I thought possible.  I will wait for a change at the top and then be very interested.

17
Avatar for kenobi

I'm not well informed on the company,  I know it's been one of these companies pi's have been interested in for 20 years or more, and if anything the price is half what it was back then. 

There was all sorts of talk about internet booths back then, a ll of which obviously came to nothing.  Paul mentions that increasingly you won't need the photobooths,  because you can provide digital pictures, or home taken pictures.   I completely agree with this,  and even aside from this,  companies like happy snaps will do it for you for only a couple of quid more than the booths,  and you get a way better result,  with someone with a bit of experience taking them, and you don't need to worry about if the booth will be working or if it's run out of paper or whatever,  and they also give you a code that you can enter into government sites which avoids you needing to scan the picture and upload it.  

So I wouldn't really attribute any long term value to the photobooth side of the market, I can't see a viable long term future for them,  even in other countries around the world as once it's shown to work in some countries with home taken pictures,  it's just a matter of time until they follow. 

The laundrette business sounds interesting,  although,  long term,  is that really a viable business ?   I understand in places like student halls of residence and other places like that,  but having a washing machine at home is a pretty basic "luxury"   I recently bought a couple of years old one for just over 100 pounds,  surely it would pay for itself in no time,   unless of course we're talking about Albert Square ! 




5
Avatar for Zipmanpeter

My key point was that we could not tell the profitability of the laundry business  of £PHTM..., 

However, I think there is a niche to go  at - whilst most people at home have a washing machine, some don't for reasons of space and some that do make have irregular big or heavy loads (eg duvets, Air BnB & other semi-professional places etc) and maybe those staying away from home who do not want an expensive hotel wash.  For these people doing a wash whilst they do a shop makes sense.  In years gone by PHTM did provide some data on T/o & cost per machine etc which is when I formed my view.  Since then it has gone dark!

2
Avatar for MrContrarian

My morning smallcap tweet:

Renewi (LON:RWI) Smartspace Software (LON:SMRT) £7DIG Batm Advanced Communications (LON:BVC) Online Blockchain (LON:OBC) Gfinity (LON:GFIN) Esken (LON:ESKN) WANdisco (LON:WAND) EQTEC (LON:EQT) Gresham Technologies (LON:GHT) Sosandar (LON:SOS) Heiq (LON:HEIQ) Cohort (LON:CHRT) Cerillion (LON:CER) Clear Leisure (LON:CLP)

Renewi (RWI) FY(Mar) underlying EBIT for FY21 expected to be significantly ahead of mgmt expectations of c. €68m. "We have continued to benefit from stronger than expected recyclate prices and resilience in bulky waste and C&D waste volumes to offset lower roller bin volumes." [SP=46 Cap=368m]
Smartspace Software (SMRT) guides FY(Jan) rev c. £4.6m down 8%. SaaS rev £2.3m up 73%. "As highlighted in earlier trading updates, Anders & Kern ("A+K") has not yet returned to pre-Covid 19 levels." Guidance reinstated for FY22 & FY23. [SP=144 Cap=41m]. I hold.
7digital (7DIG) wins 2 year contract to provide Kuaishou's mobile apps with licensed music globally.. Client has over 760m monthly active users in China. No £££. [SP=1.27 Cap=35m]
BATM Advanced Communications (BVC) launches no-swab saliva-based covid lab test. It's CE certified and detects all known variants. [SP=93.8 Cap=413m]
Online Bollockschain (OBC) appointed as an adviser to Trism, an early-stage collectables creator and original digital art distributor. Blockchain can be used to rcord provenance of digital art ownership. "No agreements as to financial terms or scope of work and therefore there is no guarantee that the arrangement will result in any quantifiable benefit to the company." [SP=71.51 Cap=10m]
Gfinity (GFIN) appointed as the Official Esports and Gaming Partner of IQONIQ, a new and unique fan engagement platform, for 3 years. Monthly fee not disclosed. [SP=3.9 Cap=31m]
Esken (ESKN) renamed Stobart FY(Feb) trading so bad no rev is given. £77.4m of cash and undrawn bank facilities. Stil trying to get shot of Stobart Air and Propius, hopes to do it in 'near term'. [SP=34 Cap=212m]
WANdisco (WAND) partnership with Snowflake, the Data Cloud company, for migration of on-premises Hadoop analytics workloads to Snowflake's cloud data platform. It's a new distribution channel for WANdisco with Snowflake's c.4000 customers. [SP=466 Cap=245m]
EQTEC (EQT) 3 year Collaboration Framework Agreement with Toyota Motor to explore waste-to-energy solution for engine manufacturing plant in Deeside. No £££. [SP=1.6 Cap=115m]
Gresham Technologies (GHT) wins €1.4m (+services revenue to deploy the solution) Clareti contract over 5 years. [SP=165.75 Cap=116m]
Sosandar (SOS) to sell a 'curated' (hateful mis-use) collection of its products through Marks & Spencer. This will "increase brand awareness across its target market, whilst driving incremental sales and accelerating improvement in EBITDA." [SP=17.5 Cap=34m]
HeiQ (HEIQ) Berger Paints India to offer antiviral paint using Viroblock. $600k in year 1. First use in paints. Watch out, here come the billions: "We are thrilled to have moved into this new US$150 billion material market." [SP=191 Cap=243m]. I hold.
Cohort (CHRT) wins £9.2m MoD contracts with majority of revenue in FY22. [SP=619.92 Cap=254m]
Cerillion (CER) a major Channel Partner relationship has yielded its first contract, worth £5m in the ME. "Implementation work has already commenced and is expected to take 12-18 months." [SP=410 Cap=121m]
Clear Leisure ((CLP) Venice court hearing due to be held yesterday rescheduled to 26 May. [SP=3.09 Cap=28m]

103
Avatar for smig78

online blockchain

3
Avatar for chrisgb

Yes it is to distinguish it from the quill pen and parchment blockchain.

12
Avatar for Will S

Surely if its blockchain then its stone tablets...

2
Avatar for Luthrin

(Deleted: replied to wrong comment)

2
Avatar for MichaelFBS

OnlineBollocksChain £OBC. Had to read that twice. Brilliant.

34
Avatar for Chrisfarrell21

Superb one today Mr C, at least three separate lolz (my proprietary rating system).

12
Avatar for Wol

Paul, do you have any thoughts on the Smartspace Software (LON:SMRT) trading update? This year's results don't look great but that's not surprising as their big hope for the future is the SaaS revenues connected to the Evoko Naso room panels. Evoko has only just started to ship these new panels which means that we should start to see significant revenue growth this year. The increases in SaaS revenues and committed annual revenues look promising. I wonder whether the move to working from home will have a permanent effect and if so how this will play out for Smartspace Software (LON:SMRT):

- less people in the office or maybe even some companies abandoning their offices altogether

+ companies will need better systems to manage room booking for employees who come in to the office but not every day

For those who don't know Smartspace Software (LON:SMRT), Gordon and Alan did an excellent presentation on the business at a recent Mello Monday online event (highly recommended).

8
Avatar for gwilli68

I dont suppose you know what date this was discussed at Mello? I'd like to take a watch but my searches cant find it. Thanks!

0
Avatar for Marcus

14th December 2020. I hold

2
Avatar for shopping365

Good morning Paul, I would welcome your thoughts on today’s ‘ahead of expectations’ results from Volution (LON:FAN) if it’s not too large for the SCVR.  Interestingly, further to yesterday’s discussion, there is mention of ‘inflationary pressures’ in their outlook statement. 

4
Avatar for TamzinXPiworld

Attraqt (LON:ATQT) Full Year 2020 results overview by the new CEO Mark Adams. In the sweet spot of online search working with large brands. Revenue up 8%. New bookings in period £4.7m (19: £3.4m). Aleph acquisition integrating well. Building on partnership strategy. 'Well placed to achieve our long term growth ambitions.'

Video and Podcast.

We also published Ultra Electronics Holdings (LON:ULE) FY20 analyst presentation yesterday. Interesting company in the defense sector, relatively new management executing their turnaround strategy.

And you've probably seen the Headlam (LON:HEAD) FY20 prentation, following Paul's excellent write up on Tuesday.

12
Avatar for Dragon

Marks And Spencer (LON:MKS) M&S to sell clothes from rival brands to boost online sales I think that includes Sosandar (LON:SOS) and Joules (LON:JOUL)

13
Avatar for snavira

it does include Sosandar (LON:SOS), they issued an RNS this morning, this was also carried on the BBC News website, although they didn’t mention Sosandar (LON:SOS)

M&S to sell clothes from rival brands to boost online sales https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/bus...

8
Avatar for ken mitchell

Here’s an interesting part of the Sosandar (LON:SOS) announcement today. So sales from the existing John Lewis and Next partnerships are strong, and adding Marks and Spencer (LON:MKS) too looks good for Marks too as they continue to “turbocharge” their online growth by working with third parties. This is also working well for Next.

Hope Paul finds time to comment on this today.

“The agreement with M&S adds to existing online partnerships that Sosandar has, having launched with both John Lewis and Next in August 2020. Sales to date from these partnerships have been strong, with a record month in February, with ranges in both continuing to expand.

The establishment of clothing partnerships is part of M&S' strategy to turbocharge online growth by working with adjacent third parties - giving new and existing customers a broader product choice. Sosandar is part of a curated group of brands to be invited to secure a strategic fashion partnership.

Ali Hall and Julie Lavington, Co-CEOs commented:

"We are delighted to secure a new partnership with another renowned British retailer, Marks & Spencer, to sell our womenswear collections. This is a strong endorsement of the appeal and quality of our clothing and our growing customer base. We have worked closely with M&S to curate a stunning launch collection and we are confident that our products will resonate well with the extensive M&S customer base. We are delighted to be working together and are excited to see a positive outcome for both our businesses.

Following on from the recent success of our partnerships with John Lewis and Next, we are thrilled that another highly respected UK retailer has invited us to stock our product on their website. This milestone agreement demonstrates the ever-growing strong appeal of our offering to our target market and the potential Sosandar has to expand through third party brands."

4
Avatar for kenobi

While this is good news,  I can't help but wonder about the effect on Margin, 

on the other hand,  it's good advertising, and you would hope that if customers discover SOS on one of these third party sites,  might at some point visit the sos site and perhaps become a direct customer.   There might be ways of incentivising customers to do this,  although I imagine the third parties will make this as difficult as possible.

4
Avatar for The Boon Fund

Finally, Marks And Spencer (LON:MKS) leveraging it's strong brand, destination status on the high Street, and top 10 traffic online store status. And monetising them through the platform model.


0
Avatar for timarr

Jarvis Securities (LON:JIM) finals:

  • 43% increase in profit before tax
  • 8% increase in year on year interest income
  • 69% growth in interim dividend per share (excludes 2019 special dividend)
  • 42% increase in EPS

Outlook:

I expect our trade volumes to continue at higher levels than we experienced in 2020 and the years leading up to that. I also see no signs of organic growth slowing as we move into 2021 with a healthy pipeline of potential new outsourcing contracts. Client numbers and cash under administration continue to increase, we are seeing profitable growth in international settlement and our relationship with Primary Bid.

If dividends are your thing with their policy of paying out excess cash they've returned 12p per share over the past year. I'd expect a similar return this year.

timarr

26
Avatar for laurie

Jarvis Securities (LON:JIM) I like JIM as both a client and as a shareholder. Of all the discount brokers that I have dealt with, Jarvis’s customer service has been the most reliable from the standpoint of having someone helpful and capable pick up the phone. The X-O service has some quirks, but it does what it should for minimal cost.

I’ve held shares in JIM in quantity for over a decade and a half; I have been more than happy with the capital appreciation and the dividends. I sold my holding very recently as I am concerned with the sustainability of the profit earned on the interest on client cash balances. Profit on interest this year was 4.58 million. Last year’s entire pre-tax profit was 4.8 million. With numbers this relevant to total profit I did not feel happy enough with the direction interest rates have been heading to continue holding JIM at the current valuation. I imagine that FY21 will have a lower profit from interest than FY20. Other brokers have mentioned reduced profit due to the fall in interest rates (e.g. Charles Stanley (LON:CAY) RNS 13.i.21). While I accept that interest rates will probably not be low forever, there is a risk of prolonged low rates and/or negative rates. I feel that the forward PE multiple does not compensate me for that risk.

This is what Jarvis Securities (LON:JIM) had to say about rates today:

The group derives a significant proportion of its revenue from interest earned on client cash deposits and does not have any borrowings. Hence, the directors do not consider the group to be materially exposed to interest rate risk in terms of the usual consideration of financing costs, but do note that there is a risk to earnings. Given the current Bank of England base rate is at its lowest level since its foundation in 1694, and the business has remained profitable, this risk is not considered material in terms of a threat to the long term prospects of the group.

9
Avatar for shanklin100

Hi laurie

Fair comments re Jarvis Securities (LON:JIM)

In terms of interest rates, your main concern I think, almost every email I receive from John Mauldin or John Authers is focused on the yield curve and the likelihood that Governments will lose control of it, especially with the US spending splurge that has just been approved. Personally, and however bad the economy gets, I see little or no possibility of interest rates going down further. Indeed IMHO, the larger risk is that short-term interest rates are kept at this level for too long and at some point have to be raised 1%+, which will feel very painful for the many people being lured into buying ludicrously overpriced houses via help to buy 95% mortgages.

I appreciate there is a view that this can be avoid by having the BoE buy a high proportion of Government debt... ...perhaps I should be working harder to understand this?

On a much more positive note, in reading their results today...

...I see that "Commisions", a term defined in the RNS, are up 59% from 2019 to 2020, and now form the largest revenue stream (39.6% in 2020; 31.6% in 2019). AIUI this includes the PrimaryBid revenue, which seems likely to grow further.

I have sold 40% of my holding in recent months, but its still over 6% of my PF, and I think its very likely to prosper particularly with if Governments lose the yield curve battle.

Also, for a company that is notably shy in providing any text in their RNS... ...its one of the shortest I have ever read in that respect... ...their outlook statement is very positive.

"I expect our trade volumes to continue at higher levels than we experienced in 2020 and the years leading up to that. I also see no signs of organic growth slowing as we move into 2021 with a healthy pipeline of potential new outsourcing contracts. Client numbers and cash under administration continue to increase, we are seeing profitable growth in international settlement and our relationship with Primary Bid."

5
Avatar for gwilli68

One interesting point with Photo-me International (LON:PHTM) is the big director purchases last year.  The CEO, the main shareholder, bought a fairly sizeable amount last year at around the current SP.  Of course, that's not a reason to invest, but Im assuming he must see that he still has something there. 

9
Avatar for Lewis Foster

I like the idea of the  juicing machines too,  surely in the right locations these can make up for the declining photobooth industry. 

However i've had to take a photo to renew my passport at home recently and doing it on the phone is harder than it looks. The background has to be perfect, the lighting has to be perfect so it can take a while to get it right. Is it that much easier than doing it after your weekly shop in an environment made for the job?   

13
Avatar for Metatron

What is odd is that despite the very significant share purchases  last summer by the Ceo who now owns over 25% of the shares the share price has barely moved.Following the CEO's purchases i bought the shares and i am still holding but not sure for how much longer?

I would have thought the CEO's purchases would have encouraged many retail investors and funds to look at Photo -Me business  but clearly very few of those who have done so have bought the shares

4
Avatar for Snoo

Pretty much I am a Photo-me bear (former holder). I dislike the move into laundry and think it's an expensive move into a market which utilises very limited technology when they should have innovated (the machines work in much the same way as it did 30 years ago and come with all the same downsides); in future it may also be open to disruption.

My own suspicion that the laundry profitability isn't being reported is because the numbers aren't great.

5
Avatar for Zipmanpeter

Perfect example of why they should share some numbers.  We both speculate.......and don't invest.  (My guess is that it was poor - hence hidden -  but is now good.  But only mgt know!)

1
Avatar for Martin VT

Paul, I completely echo your thoughts re easy to access company presentations.
These have become critical for me to getting a quality and depth of information that databases such as Stockopedia and Sharepad can’t provide, unless through (the excellent) SCVR or similar.
Recent examples for me have been Tharisa (LON:THS) which did a great presentation last year, which put the capital works to restructure its opencast mine into much greater relief, and emphasised that the large capital works were coming to an end, hence the opportunity for substantial growth, not just from PGM price rises but also from expanded capacity. Tharisa (LON:THS) did another Company meet Investor presentation yesterday, which has left me with the conclusion that much as, amongst many of you, I ‘love’ Sylvania Platinum (LON:SLP), it is Tharisa (LON:THS) that I am more likely to be holding in 2-3 years, due to their significant growth opportunities.
I have also benefited from the presentations of Rbg Holdings (LON:RBGP), who presented on Monday to Mello, and have done a number on Investor meet Company. They had a difficult year in 2020, as they had bought one subsidiary, Convex Capital, in late 2019 and had set up another, Lionfish Litigation, in early 2020. Because of the pandemic, there was little to nothing to show for these new additions in 2020 and the share price drifted down throughout the year. But because of the clarity in their presentations, of the strategy and rationale for the subsidiaries, I became confident in buying more shares at their depressed price last autumn (I’m usually hopeless at this). I particularly recommend the recent Rbg Holdings (LON:RBGP) presentation that includes the excellent MD of Lionfish subsidiary, Tets Ishikawa, as this further helps show the potential of £RBGP.
Conversely, I have also found that company presentations have helped confirm, or even originate, scepticism or concerns about a company; of course this aspect is potentially just as valuable as finding a bargain!

I completely endorse the notion that any contact we have with a company’s management should be used to encourage them to use media such as PI World, Investor meet Company or indeed Mello to give private investors access to management, and indeed the reverse, to make us private investors tangible and relevant to companies.

I hold the companies mentioned.

60
Avatar for Martin VT

Further to my comment re company presentations to private investors: 

I was looking at a trading update from last week of one of my holdings Morses Club (LON:MCL) and noted that it would be doing an analyst presentation in May. So I looked up their investor relations contact and sent  them an email requesting that they do private investor presentations on InvestorMeetCompany or similar, setting out the benefits to both parties.

It took a few minutes. I think I will try to make it a habit that when I see reference to results announcements for a company I hold, without reference to a private investor presentation, I will send an email requesting one.

Obviously the more of us who do this the quicker we will change the culture re private investor communications.

23
Avatar for sharw

Re: company presentations I agree - we need to tell them!

I was interested in Braemar after Roland Head's SIF article last month and then John Sladden in Stockslam the following day. I decided to make a final decision when there was a CMD on the 9th. Come Tuesday we had an RNS proclaiming it was for institutional investors and sell-side analysts with the slides available on the website as a sop to PIs.

On reading Paul's opening remarks this morning, like you I decided it was time for action. I fired off an email to Buchanan (Braemar's PR) saying "That tells me that the company doesn't care for private investors and so I have closed my file on this one".  (I have found on other matters in the past that going through the Financial PR can get a better response than going direct to the company).

Now for my next target:

6049feba9e8b1tracsis.png


10
Avatar for Martin VT

Excellent!

For reference here is the email that I sent to Morses Club (LON:MCL) :

Good Morning

I note that Morses Club is doing an presentation to analysts in May.

Could I request that you in addition use the excellent vehicle of Investor Meet Company to make regular presentations to private investors. A number of companies in my portfolio are now using this medium, and it is being found to be valuable to both the companies and the private investors.

The benefits are broadly:

* Access for investors to management

* Access for management to investors (many of whom specialise in smaller cap companies) both existing and potential

* Presentations and detailed Q&A are recorded and easily available on the IMC website

* Management get the opportunity to hear and respond to concerns of private investors

* Management get a better appreciation of the level of sophistication of many private investors (an antidote to some of the racier bulletin board postings)

* Undervalued companies with a robust case to demonstrate their value are better able to communicate that value effectively through this medium

* Use of this means of private investor communications is rapidly becoming an expectation of private investors, and we are placing a high value on this type of communication

Kind Regards

Martin

Martin Van Tol

For reference, I have no connection with Investor Meet Company other than as a very satisfied user. Other routes to achieve this goal include PI World, and the Mello Investor events.


The key point to try to get across to companies is that this sort of dialogue is valuable to the company as well as to private investors, particularly for Small Caps where we are often more likely to 'move the dial' re prices (in both directions) than long term institutions.

But yes, the more of us who contact and request, the more we are are likely to get!

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Avatar for Zipmanpeter

Martin VT - Agree so much that I copied your letter and sent same to Morses Club (LON:MCL) as well  !

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Avatar for garbetklb

I've just emailed them :

I've been a shareholder in Tracsis for 8 years; accounts I run for our wider family hold xx,xxx shares via various nominee accounts.

One of the positive aspects of Tracsis has been its willingness to engage with its private shareholder base. I'm therefore dismayed to see that the Interim Results Conference Call on 8 April is excluding private investors - Why?

Why should you favour one group of shareholders over another? And does this foreshadow a change in your approach to your private shareholder base?

I look forward to your comments

Regards

And if they don't reply, I'll call the FD.......

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Avatar for garbetklb

I emailed Tracsis yesterday & got a reply from their PR company (which, in itself, annoys me!) denying that there was to be an investor call on 8th.  So I wonder where you saw the item in your post?

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Avatar for sharw

In my post is a screenshot from finnCap - the nomad for Tracsis.

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Avatar for MichaelFBS

Martin do you have a link to the Tharisa (LON:THS) presentation?  I hold £SLP. 

Thank you

Michael. 

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Avatar for Martin VT

Hi Michael

I've just checked and the Tharisa (LON:THS) recording is up on the https://www.investormeetcompan... website, from yesterday 10th March. If by any chance you don't use this website I recommend it.

Re Tharisa (LON:THS) Stocko states that the CE has a 2.8% holding. I also did a bit of basic maths (from the presentation figures) and even with moderate assumptions about quantity and price I think that if prices for PGMs and Chrome stay anywhere near current valuations (a big 'if', I know) then the broker estimates on Stockopedia are potentially significantly under stated.

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Avatar for Surrey Steve

Hi Martin

I would like to thank you for drawing Tharisa (LON:THS) to my attention a little while ago.  Having just watched the IMC presentation, I agree with your views on the long term potential for this company.

Hopefully I'll be able to buy you a drink at some point in the not too distant future!

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Avatar for Martin VT

Thanks Steve,

You're welcome and I look forward to it. All the usual caveats about DYOR etc, but sounds like you have. 

Coincidently I have just finished running numbers for Tharisa (LON:THS), taking price and volume from Qu 1 update, minimum production target and 85% of the prices quoted by CE in his presentation yesterday. That gets me to a revenue of $780m, rather higher than the current estimate of $545! Even if you calculate at 70% of the quoted prices I still get to $667m. 

Many a slip between cup and lip, but here's hoping.

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Avatar for Dojosan

£THS  - the SP is rather stagnant the mo. because there is a persistent seller . Watching the SP action can be amusing. The trades are awash with buys, yet the SP hardly moves or on some days has retraced a little. The next day - it's a groundhog day! Sooner or later the dam's going to bust. Here's to hoping. I hold. 

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